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DarkwingDuckk
06 November at 23:37
@IkariX it's a good thing IDGAF about your opinion then, lol
It may surprise you to know that other people have different experiences to your own. But I know that concept may be too far out of reach for you.

As for Nexus, I don't know why you ban people that have legitimate points relating to polls you create. None of what I said was out of line, but clearly you prefer sycophants like IkariX on the forum instead of customers who have legitimate criticism of your logistics (which you make us pay for).
Joman187
06 November at 19:34
Nexushub has the best customer service no doubt. I have had other retailers that don't care about restocking on sold out titles but yet nexushub helped get me townfall steelbooks and control resonant steelbooks even though they were sold out. No one cares about delivery fees as long as you get the physical game in good condition like I have, especially steelbooks which can be fragile.
IkariX
06 November at 15:13
@DarkWingDuck

I'm going to call [censored] on your post. I've been buying from Nexus since the AnimeWorx days from about 2008. I have literally never ever had bad customer service from NexusHub. So you are being disingenuous. I don't think you appreciate the great lengths they go to, to get these games for us. But enjoy your other retailers and their[censored] service.
VectorTwoSix
06 November at 13:17
MrOde very good point! I'd pay extra for express overnight shipping.

HaseoVII SAME regarding FF7Rebirth (best believe I preordered Revelation though )

I am such a huge fan of Nexus Hub - no one else in SA imports the niche titles - I used to need to get my stuff from Amazon Japan/US
HaseoVII
06 November at 13:07
My backlog is so big I don't care how late I get my orders lol haven't even played FF7 Rebirth or even Stellar Blade yet, but that's just me.
MrOde
06 November at 12:56
I'd actually go even further and say do standard free shipping for all orders above R1000 but allow an express shipping option/add on for those that want to pay extra. I would gladly pay extra to get whatever I ordered the day after I order it.
DarkPrince
06 November at 12:29
Shipping costs on games? What's that?
VectorTwoSix
06 November at 12:02
I'm not looking to start a bad thread about this, I was really just curious because I misclicked the tab on the left and stumbled upon the poll (I'd never clicked it before).

I am fiercely brand loyal to Nexus Hub and I don't care too much about not getting a game day-1. I know other names like BT and Koodoo ship earlier so you get it on release, but I'd never be "that" excited that I must play day-1, life happens
On the other hand, paying an extra R150 every time you order a commercially available title does add up, and I would not blame the average consumer for trying to save some money.

I know I'd feel less off about it if there was a price match, and free delivery at a certain threshold.
Cathal
06 November at 12:01
I mean if I can save money, why wouldn't I?

Are there circumstances where I would pay that extra without thinking twice about it, yes. In general there's little reason to do so.

That said, touching on Darkwing's point of eBucks, payment options feel like a lot bigger point than the R50 delivery. Lot of places offering rewards, pay later, etc. Those are big pull points for customers.
DarkwingDuck
06 November at 11:44
For niche titles it's okay. Problem is I play mainly bigger titles. Games are expensive enough as is. If I can save 50 bucks, use my ebucks (which some retailers allow) then I'm definitely going with another retailer.

Basically if I have to choose between paying delivery or not I'm going to go for not paying for delivery. On top of that, I find my Nexus orders are usually delayed. I don't think I've ever received a game on release day which is annoying when you're paying extra for delivery especially. And often you have to ask where it is which I don't think the customer should have to do, that's part of customer service.
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Feature

Fight Me Friday: The Outer Worlds "Boycott" Is a Joke

by Robert de Wit on 29 March, 2019

    5   8

     

Recently, I was visiting the ever-pleasant Steam forums, looking at what positive outpourings my fellow Steam users had to say (ed - I sense a hint of sarcasm). I was shocked to find out that they were, in fact, acting unreasonably negative towards Obsidian, especially about the exclusivity deal with Epic Games for The Outer Worlds.

Let's just call it as it is; this "boycott" on Steam is pathetic. Reading through the forums, I was actually bewildered at the rudimentary and straw-man arguments that these people were using, to "justify" their anger towards Obsidian and Epic Games. Is the Epic Games store favourable to other game launchers? Of course not, but should you behave in an entitled manner, just because they are "anti-consumer"? Definitely not.



First off, let's talk about this "data-mining" argument that often gets referenced in the thread. The argument stands, that Epic Games has been found to sell personal data of its users to third-party companies for marketing purposes. My response is two-fold; first, how many accounts/websites/sign-ins have you used your email address for? Your cellphone number? So, would Epic be the only cause of your information being put out there? Insurance companies, banks, your cellphone network provider, your medical aid, all of these sell data to marketing companies. Does this make it right? Hell, no. Can you penalise Epic for it, as if they are the only ones doing it? Hell, no. Second, the irony is amazing, considering they are using Steam forums to slander a game's launcher for selling user data. Again, this doesn't justify it, but you cannot slander one and praise the other, for the same act.

The second biggest criticism is that the Epic Store is "anti-consumer". Now, this word has been twisted and tortured to mean so much, that whenever someone uses it, it kind of loses meaning. There have been many anti-consumer practices in recent months. Anthem is the biggest example, where the developer has been consistently promising new fixes and features, but failing to deliver. The Destiny franchise has also been anti-consumer, especially the first, where the base game cost R900+, then you had to buy the R500+ season pass, and still, fork out more for extra content. This would be okay if the content was worthwhile, but the base game's story was generic and just poor overall. These are examples of anti-consumerism; not a developer (or publisher) who has decided to opt for a platform that will put more money, resulting in possible sequels and more content, into the budgets of a studio. Anti-consumer is not "I don't like it".



Carrying on from this, an interesting feature appeared on Eurogamer, where they had an exclusive interview with Tim Sweeney, the founder of the Epic Games store. In the piece, Sweeney talks about the objectives of the Epic Games store, where he stated: "I understand gamers not appreciating that, these are things that are invisible to you. How much of your money goes to a developer, how much goes to Valve - you just can't tell, as a gamer. As a developer, it's critically important to your livelihood - the difference between 70 percent and 88 percent can be the difference between going out of business or growing. Very few developers have a 30 percent profit margin. This isn't some small difference to them. They have all the costs of building their game, paying their employees, marketing their game, paying for user acquisition. For most games, the store makes more profit than the developer makes. It's critically important to fix that - popular or not, it's a strategy that's necessary and it's proving to work".

This is something that Valve will never say - they make more money on the games they sell, than the developers do. At the end of the day, if you are comfortable with the developer - who has spent years creating a game you love - earning less than the storefront - who took a couple of hours to put it up - does. Maybe it's time to look in the mirror.



Should this argument apply to a game that you can see developers have not exhausted all of their efforts on? Maybe not, but for the most part, especially a company like Obsidian, developers offer their literal homes and entire life savings to create a project, only for a store to reap better benefits. As important as it is to remember the economic circumstances of the gamers, it's doubly as important to remember the livelihoods of the developer behind excellent games.

Rather than simply reacting to their cases, though, let's make a few arguments of our own. Games boycotts have always been around, and while a good portion of them have been justified, there are others that have not. For example, Metro Exodus recently launched exclusively on the Epic Store, to which fans responded by negatively review-bombing previous titles, dragging their score down. Turns out, Metro Exodus doubled its PC sales compared to Metro Last Light, and those same people who were criticising a game purely for its storefront, were now praising it. Okay, I get it, people can change their minds, sure, but does this not still indicate a problem? The fact that people are willing to give a game a negative score, no matter how great it is, purely because of its storefront?

Another problem we are having in the community, is the sense of entitlement that seems to be creeping in. A few comments on the thread have quoted "they won't get my money", "I have lost all faith", and "Obsidian has sold out"; while we all have a right to refuse a product, we also have a responsibility to respect the people who are selling it. This links back into what I have said before, there are games that do offer anti-consumer behaviour and deserved to be called out on it. However, when you are using these arguments to justify the fact that they shouldn't be earning what they deserve, because you don't like a platform? Again, take a deep, long look in the mirror. Before the retorts come, I do not know if The Outer Worlds will be good, but we also don't know it will be bad.



Now, let's look at what's actually being criticised: The Epic Store. As a game launcher, Epic Games is not my favourite, and it certainly hasn't been on my PC before Darksiders 3, Metro Exodus, and now The Outer Worlds, were announced as exclusives. Has my experience been good? Not exactly, considering I do get asked a number of times "Do you want to install Fortnite?". Has it got the features that most are looking for? No, but Epic has been bringing fixes and more features, as their revenue stream increases. Should it stop with the incessant Fortnite install request? Absolutely. Does the slight inconvenience, which can be fixed, give a valid reason as to why The Outer Worlds, and the likes, shouldn't be exclusives? I'll say it again, hell no. The Epic Store, for all its quirks, is not unnecessarily convoluted, it is not "anti-consumer", and it's certainly not the ugliest UI around (looking at you Steam). At the end of the day, the Epic Store sold a large portion of Darksiders 3 on PC, it sold double the copies of Metro Exodus compared to Last Light (on Steam), and I doubt the growth will stop at The Outer Worlds.

Finally, I want to talk to you, the person who might just be agreeing with this boycott. I would like to find out from you, without argument, judgment, or the likes, if you would be okay with working years on a personal project, sometimes pouring every last cent you have, and possibly putting your entire family on the streets, only for a third-party to make more revenue than you? If you can honestly, with the greatest of emotional empathy, say yes to that, then perhaps you are the problem.

Okay, my rant is over. Can The Outer Worlds just release already, please?


Robert de Wit

Loves games with deep character development and a rich storyline. Also, shooty-shooties. Loathes microtransactions. Likes to use sarcasm and metaphors.

See more articles by Robert

There are 8 comments

Rob_Osiris
@Fantomex, honestly, I never really though it would go beyond Metro. I referenced Metro because this boycott about Outer Worlds was a breaking point for me, but this began with Metro. I feel the same way as Metro as I do with Outer Worlds, but I referenced Outer Worlds more becuase it is the latest case. Boycotting, for me, is rarely excusable, but in the case of Metro, it was just as pathetic as this is.
Blaze
@Fantomex I think there were a few vocal groups over the Metro move to Epic, but Obsidian's one hits a little closer to home for many gamers because of their reputation in the industry (they are known as one of the best). And plus with this being Fallout's spiritual successor, it called for a lot more people to be vocal. But I do agree with Rob, the boycotting thing is utterly ridiculous.
Fantomex
Why weren't there any straightforward articles like this in defense of Metro or their developers when they did the same thing? Is the Obsidian jerk so strong that when they do it, boycotting is suddenly inexcusable?
Rob_Osiris
@Vice this is my argument @lurch, I agree, i would love a unified library with all my games but boycotting a company because of it? I mean, c'mon. You're absolutely right, these folks will probably install Epic from day one, and that is the hypocrisy that needs to be weeded out
Fire Crotch
Anyone else remember the 'Boycott Modern Warfare 2' Steam group? xD
Lurch
It's a joke because gamers have been lapping up his[censored] for years. We're not suddenly in this situation because publishers decided to become evil money-grubbing arseholes overnight (and that's a gross generalisation ignoring the fact the Epic store is offering a bigger cut to the developers). I'm willing to bet more than half the commentators on these forums will read a few reviews and, if favourable, they'll be installing the Epic Launcher.

That said, I'm a big fan of a unified library, so maybe it's time for developers to come up with library apps that can integrate with several storefronts and simply serve as a front end.
TempestXtreme
This debate barely affects me, I'm getting it on PS4, but it really is stupid.
Vice Cerberus
I am really am a console only person due to finances.

But let me get this straight. Steam takes a huge chunk of the profits for doing practically nothing, while the dev get the short end of the stick?

Who cares about 'anti-consumer' I say people should instead look at 'anti-developer' practices instead. If people are going to boycott anything boycott steam for these practices.

However I have no right to say that considering I don't game on computers.

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